AOD install update [Archive] - PoMoFoRacing Forums

HoustonLX

02-08-2005, 11:24 AM

Most of you know I recently came across a deal to swap my T5 set-up for a Ross House Built AOD set-up with a PI converter. Well, the swap has ended up taking a little longer then expected. I took the PI converter to Circle D Transmissions to have restalled. A new pump and stator later and I had the stall raised to where I HOPE will work best for my combo. Then took The BBK LT's I had to a muffler shop to get new O2 bungs welded in to relocate the O2 sensors. The trans install went smoothly with no problems. Where we had the problems was with the exhaust install. I THOUGHT I had done all the research and the BBK headers would work with a little clearencing of the trans bell. Welp, I was wrong! The passenger side header fit like a champ. The drivers side was the problem. The collector hit the trans pan and shifter linkage. This forced the purchase of a new exhaust. Something that would actually work with an AOD. Luckily I found a deal on some Mac LT's with a Dr Gas X-pipe. That worked out great since I was really hoping to stay with LT's and not go back to shorties. The new LT's arrived yesterday and were installed last night. They fit like a glove. All that remains is installing the X-pipe, running the trans cooler lines, and adjusting the shifter linkage and TV cable. With a little luck, the car will be up and running by tomorrow night. I plan on making a trip to HRP this weekend to see what the car runs. Hopefully I will be able to compete in that Index event in 2 weeks at HRP.

White90GT

02-08-2005, 11:36 AM

Congrats guy. On to the boring life of automatic trannies. Hopefully the ET will still be as good as it was with the 5 speed if not a touch better!

Guffinator

02-08-2005, 12:10 PM

Sounds good Shane. Lemme know when you're going to HRP, I might tag along with my camera.

HoustonLX

02-08-2005, 04:41 PM

Sounds good Shane. Lemme know when you're going to HRP, I might tag along with my camera.

Why not tag along WITH YOUR CAR? You need some 1/4 numbers anyway. :naughty:

Blue91

02-08-2005, 05:51 PM

He has to figure out wtf is up with it first. He's workin on it though, last I heard.

I wanna go to the track and race BAD. I need to get my car DONE!!!!!

maveRick

02-08-2005, 05:51 PM

I know someone who got a few 1.5X 60's with that tranny! ;)

You'll love it for consistancy's sake anyway (your particular goal).

Good luck! :thumb:

Otis!

02-08-2005, 06:04 PM

Ok, I'm off next week, and I got tags and insurance on the black bomb Friday. If I can get the brakes bled and put 500 miles on it, I may join you guys!

O!
...not promising, just thinking...

HoustonLX

02-09-2005, 09:20 AM

Update on last nights events:

I cheered, I cussed, I cried, I threw things, and got the bloody hands to prove it.

Turns out the headers do not fit like a glove. The drivers side collector ends at an odd angle. With the way the header is angled, the x-pipe hits the crossmember mounting point. Not the crossmember itself. I am soooo irked right now, if I had hair, I would be pulling it out. Not only that, but it appears the X-pipe is about 2-3 inches to long and won't bolt into the cat-back. /me takes a step back to cool off.

Luckily Mr. Neighbors is kind enough to swing by Thursday night with his welding maching. We plan on cutting/beating/welding/forcing the X-pipe so hopefully it will fit.

I find all this funny. The trans swap itself went reletively smooth. Of all things, its the damn exhaust thats kicking my ars.

:riped: :crying:

BigRed

02-09-2005, 09:36 AM

HoustonLX

02-09-2005, 10:03 AM

Exhaust Blows :rolleyes:

I had similar problems getting my dr gas x pipe to fit the collectors.
Had to re-engineer the whole forward section. PITA

Your almost there.

Yep. Thats what we are going to have to do. I have to find a shop locally with a 2 1/2" piece of tubing with a 90 degree bend so we can work some angles.

Otis!

02-09-2005, 11:30 AM

LOL! And that's why I refuse to work on exhausts!

O!

Chuck98GT

02-09-2005, 05:10 PM

http://webpages.charter.net/hoekstrc/stuff/dr_gas.jpg

This is my x-pipe. Drivers side collector ends up pointing at the cross member outboard of the hump.

Top of the pic is the drivers side

HoustonLX

02-09-2005, 05:24 PM

http://webpages.charter.net/hoekstrc/stuff/dr_gas.jpg

This is my x-pipe. Drivers side collector ends up pointing at the cross member outboard of the hump.

Top of the pic is the drivers side

Thats EXACTLY what mine needs to look like. Mine doesn't have the curve. The top section basically matches the bottom section. VERY intersting. Did you have to moddify yours like that to fit or did it come like that from Dr. Gas? Thanks for the pic dude.

Blue91

02-09-2005, 07:04 PM

Mine looks the exact same from when I had the AOD. I will be cutting it apart and making it fit the BBK headers I got.

If it was 2.5", I'd give you the section Im cutting, but alas, it's 3".

http://pomofo.com/91GLX/Progress/Xpipe/P1010095.JPG
http://pomofo.com/91GLX/Progress/Xpipe/P1010091.JPG
http://pomofo.com/91GLX/Progress/Xpipe/p1010101.jpg

HoustonLX

02-09-2005, 08:43 PM

Thanks anyway, Fred. Troy was able to cut up the existing X-pipe and use part of a 90* bend he bought for it today. We have the angles all right now and just waiting for Mr Neighbors to show up with his welding maching to complete it. All that is left now is to weld up the X-pipe and fill the AOD with fluid. Hopefully I will be taking it for a test drive tomorrow night.

/me has his fingers crossed.

Otis!

02-09-2005, 09:02 PM

Tools are loaded...

O!

FoMoCo1

02-10-2005, 01:29 PM

my h pipe is exactly like that one too...its for an aod...

HoustonLX

02-11-2005, 09:18 AM

Exhaust was finished and car was fired up last night. All gears appear to be functioning properly. We couldn't take it for a drive because I am missing the clip that hold the TV cable to the TB. Should be picking one up today. The car also has a slight idle surge and the check engine light came on (I also swapped to a A9P comp). Hopefully thats just the new comp learning all the settings.

Chuck98GT

02-11-2005, 10:14 AM

The check engine light is not it learning the new settings. Does a 5 speed harness have a NDS wire? (neutral drive safty switch)

HoustonLX

02-11-2005, 01:29 PM

The check engine light is not it learning the new settings. Does a 5 speed harness have a NDS wire? (neutral drive safty switch)

I believe so. Its was my understanding the pigtail from the AOD would stab right in and it did. Ummm..I hope. :ity:

HoustonLX

02-11-2005, 07:34 PM

Last update...hopefully

The car is now out of the garage and rolling under its own power. Took it for a little drive and most everything seems ok. The trans feels like the converter is locking up as soon as it shifts to third. I did notice a miss and popping out the exhaust under heavy acceleration. That could be the reason for the check engine light. I am going to double check the plug wires and make sure there is no vacume leaks.

maveRick

02-14-2005, 06:46 PM

The trans feels like the converter is locking up as soon as it shifts to third. I did notice a miss and popping out the exhaust under heavy acceleration. That could be the reason for the check engine light. I am going to double check the plug wires and make sure there is no vacume leaks.

Are you sure it's "locking up"? - or is it just going into Overdrive sooner than you would like?

Until the toggle switch is wired to the tranny, the only way you can control it from going into Overdrive is by the postion of the throttle (stays in 3rd longer at WOT).

Troy stopped by the house and in 'general converstion' told me you are using the same computer that was in the coupe too (makes sense), but remember when I was asking about what else I should look for when I had that rough idle and I couldn't find it the culprit? I think you may have found it. :(

Just mentioning: You might want to borrow someone's computer and see if it does the same thing.

On the other hand, my 'check engine' light didn't come on on either car that the combo was in (vert and coupe).

Good luck with it and call me if you have any questions about the characteristics of the combo when I had it.

HoustonLX

02-14-2005, 07:22 PM

Thanks Rick. The miss turned out to be a loose spark plug wire. That also cleared up (for the most part) the check engine light. Although the Check Engine light never came on Sat or yesterday, it did come on this morning for a few minutes till the car was warm. Actually it did that before the tranny swap. There really isn't a rough idle. It does surge ever so slightly sometimes. But not enough to bother me. Usually it just sits around 800 rpm's. The surge is only maybe a 50-100 rpm surge. The converter is deffinately locking up immediately on the 2-3 shift. And I know its not OD. You can feel that later (usually around 50 mph under normal driving). Overall I am very pleased with the tranny thus far. I think the car really likes my converter selection. I have only gotten on it a few times on the street. When I did, it hazed the tires threw all of first and half of second. granted I was on hard street radials LOL. I was hoping to take the car to the track Sunday, but they were all rained out. I am going to try to take it to either HMP or HRP Friday night to see if I have a chance of competing Sat. If it runs at the track as good as it feels on the street, I should have no problem.

One thing I did notice is the tranny does have a "chatter" of sorts sometimes. usually you only here it around 50-60 mph and in OD. Although I do here it other times every now and then. Not sure what that could be but it is very nocticable. I might get Troy to either ride with me or take it for a spin to get his impression on what the problem could be.

nintylx

02-14-2005, 07:47 PM

Chatter? could it be the clutch in the converter chattering on lock-up? kellies T-bird did this and had the wrong fluid in it. After the company that replaced the tranny changed the fluid to to merc-III from type F it was fine.

HoustonLX

02-14-2005, 08:45 PM

I put Mercon III in it.

Blue91

02-14-2005, 09:40 PM

Chatter could also be slipping od band?

I'm not sure what to think about "feeling it" lock up. Cristina's car had a lockup and the only way we ever knew was due to the dyno graph. You couldn't feel anything as far as lockup. It wouldn't shift from 1st till 2nd till like 5500-6k, but once it was in 2nd, it would only hold for maybe 1-2 seconds at WOT before shifting to 3rd. I believe that was due to the valve body though, since my AOD did the same exact thing when it had that VB.

Anyways, good luck on it! Get the OD delete switch wired up before you race it. While the trans aren't SUPPOSED to go into OD at WOT, I have seen them and "felt them" do so. You'll toast the OD band quick if you wait too long on wiring up the switch. It's VERY easy to do.

HoustonLX

02-15-2005, 10:11 PM

Found the "chattering". Actually Troy did. Turns out it was just the driver side header collector hitting the underside of the body. With the key off and the motor not moving, there was about an 1/8" clearence. However, when the motor is running, its shaking and that clearence becomes ummmm nothing? Especially when under load and the motor is wanting to torque over. We did a little bit of clearencing with a pry bar. It helped some for now. I still need to do some more massaging to the under body to eliminate it completely. Atleast that its not the converter which was my main worry. The motor does seem to be breaking up at high rpm's again. Gonna have to look into that. Odd it seems to happen after the tranny swap.

I want to take this time to give a HHUUUUGGGGGEEEEEEE thanks to Troy. Not only did he give me access to the use of his garage throughout the entire tranny swap, but he was also there the entire time with wrench in hand. Without his guidance, I would still be swiddling my thumbs and scratching my ass on several of the issues that showed its ugly face durring the swap. Thanks again dude. i own you BIG time.

TxBandit

02-15-2005, 10:38 PM

.... i own you BIG time....

WTF cocksta? :mad:

No problem, it took longer than expected, but projects like that usually do. Glad that it's 99% sorted out.

Also too, is "swiddling" anything like "stroodlin"??

Troy

Blue91

02-15-2005, 10:43 PM

lol.

I'd rather be "twiddling" my thumbs than stroodlin', haha

HoustonLX

02-17-2005, 01:22 PM

Ok, so I said I was done with the "updates". Well, I lied. ever since the car has been back on the road, it has run perfect under normal driving conditions with one exception. The car would sputter and pop out the exhaust under load when I tried to get on it. A conversation with Mr. Warwas revealed he has the same thing happen to him once before. He told me to check and maybe replace all the spark plugs.

Flash back to tranny swap...

Durring the swap, we had to remove the old BBK LT headers and install more AOD friendly Mac LT's. That whole time we never pulled the plugs. just worked around them.

After the talk with Brian, I bought a new set of plugs and just did the swap. I found the exact problem Brian had suffered when his car acted the same way. Apparently the passenger side header had banged onto a spark plug a little to hard. When I pulled it, the #3 cylinder plug had 3-4 small cracks running almost the entire length of the porcellin. Even though the others looked fine, I went ahead and installed new plugs into all 8 cylinders for good measures.

The car now raps out perfect without any sputtering or missing and the check engine light has yet to come back on. Thanks again for the advice, Brian.

TxBandit

02-17-2005, 01:28 PM

Apparently the passenger side header had banged onto a spark plug a little to hard.

I did that on purpose. :fu:

Tyro

White90GT

02-17-2005, 03:38 PM

Bah, you needed new plugs anyways. Did you gap them for the nitrous! :woohoo

TxBandit

02-17-2005, 03:45 PM

Bah, you needed new plugs anyways. Did you gap them for the nitrous! :woohoo

I'd like to conduct an experiment. We'll yank YOUR motor out, tear it down and gap the rings at about .080 in order to get a little extra oil in the cylinders. Then we'll go out and spray the poop out of YOUR motor and see what happens.

As I understand it, Shane has made an educated decision to NOT spray his motor.

Troy

HoustonLX

02-17-2005, 05:09 PM

:werd:

The plugs were gapped normal as I have no intention of spraying the motor any time soon. This shortblock is already in bad shape. I do not have the time, money, or place to do the work after the nitrous/oil combination blows a head gasket. The car will more then likely be left untouched and only raced as is the rest of this year.

White90GT

02-18-2005, 06:59 AM

Geez guys I'm just messin around!

HoustonLX

02-19-2005, 12:24 PM

Last update with track times. I finally tested the new tranny at the track last night and the results were not exactly what I was hoping for. The car slowed down over .2 and lost 3 mph in the 1/8.

Best pass came foot braking it and shifting manually

1.83 60'....8.72 @ 77 mph

Best pass with the 5-speed

1.79 60'....8.50 @ 80 mph

oh well!

:ashamed:

TxBandit

02-19-2005, 12:32 PM

But you forgot to mention that once you figure out to wire in a switch to keep the converter unlocked that the car will more than likely pick up some more E.T. Also who cares if the MPH is down. If you can get to the finish line quicker using less power you have made an improvement.

Troy